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Post by Kamikaze Koopa on Feb 23, 2005 20:15:03 GMT -5
One question that has always been on my mind is, where did the shyguys come from? Paper Mario suggests that they originated from a toybox and that they are all simply toys come to life.
I have a different theory, however. Ever since I played Yoshi's Island for the first time I have always been curious about Spearguys (and later, Island Guys). Then it occured to me that the Spearguys and Island Guys may actually be the original Shyguys. That would explain why they never take off their masks (because it is part of their tribal heritage) and why they mostly seem to be encountered on Yoshi's Island. I believe that shyguys were once native to Yoshi's Island and lived in tribes, much like the yoshis themselves. However, when Kamek and his forces came to the island they enslaved/enlisted the shyguys as servants and footsoldiers.
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Post by Claws on Feb 25, 2005 7:41:30 GMT -5
Good theory. It really suits the shyguys--they seem a little primitive. Probably some escaped the island after being enslaved and formed their own societies (such as the toybox).
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Post by TakuTheSamurai on Feb 28, 2005 18:06:59 GMT -5
The shyguy's originally came from the land of Subcon. (SMB2). After a deal with Bowser, they had the opportunity to take charge of a toybox. Can't say I can reason tehir appearance in SMW2, though.
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Post by Kamikaze Koopa on Feb 28, 2005 18:35:47 GMT -5
True, but it's unknown whether Subcon actually existed or if it was simply a figment of Mario's imagination. The reason I beleive alot of enemies were "re-used" in SMB2 from SMW2 is that Mario originally encountered all these enemies when he was an infant of Yoshi's Island, and they were only subconcious memories in subcon.
Oh wow, I just suddenly realized the connection between Subcon and subconcious.
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Post by TakuTheSamurai on Feb 28, 2005 18:43:03 GMT -5
I never beat SMB2, so Check me on this....
Mario/wart (And accomplices) could have broken that seal between Subcon and reality, thus allowing the Shyguy race to migrate to Yoshi's Island. You'll also notice that the Pokey's also originated from subcon, and their skins turned a more sandy color with time.
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Post by Kamikaze Koopa on Feb 28, 2005 19:07:09 GMT -5
Here's the ending of SMB2. (if you don't mind spoilers) www.vgmuseum.com/end/gba/a/maradv.htmThey never say anything about breaking the bonds between the two realities. They only imply that he freed the Subcons from Wart's reign. |
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Post by Claws on Mar 1, 2005 7:52:22 GMT -5
See, I think that Subcon was originally a figment of Mario's imagination. But then it became real for some reason. I cite Super Smash Bros. Melee. In that game, Subcon is one of the arenas; therefore, it actually existed and still exists.
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Post by Kamikaze Koopa on Mar 1, 2005 9:39:32 GMT -5
Although, it's pretty much been proven that the Smash Bros games didn't actually happen. It was all a twisted game created by the Master Hand (and Crazy Hand too, I suppose).
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Post by Claws on Mar 1, 2005 18:08:01 GMT -5
That's where we disagree. I think Master Hand did actually stage a dimension- and time-spanning tournament with various Nintendo characters as the combatants. I also don't think the beginning cutscene of SSB can be cited as evidence against this. Notice there's no reference to this odd scene in Melee. Obviously the developers wanted us to drop the idea that it wasn't a real event with the real heroes fighting.
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Post by Kamikaze Koopa on Mar 1, 2005 21:15:16 GMT -5
Well, it's been shown that in SSB the fighters were actually just dolls brought to life by Master Hand as opposed to the actual characters themselves. However, in SSBM it's been made pretty clear that the fighters were model trophies this time around instead of dolls, but they still weren't the actual characters themselves.
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Post by TakuTheSamurai on Mar 2, 2005 2:03:31 GMT -5
THoughts (See fanific ideas i stole) have been spread saying that SSBM is real is a sense, but not in the way we would normally perceive it. The idea is that when Master hand sets up a match, the trophies act like beacons. The real character gets faint, and falls to the ground. When they awake, they are filled with the desire to fight and when the match is over, the energy is drained and they return to their normal lives. Don't ask me how it works, i'm stealing this idea. But we are getting off topic.
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Post by Kamikaze Koopa on Mar 2, 2005 7:38:00 GMT -5
Hmmm, and interesting theory. I guess I should rephrase my previous statement and say that even if they were the actual Nintendo characters they aren't in the same universe/timeline , and that Master Hand transported they them to and from the arenas. Whether the arenas themselves are actually in the seperate Nintendo universes or whether Master Hand created them, I can't say.
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Post by Claws on Mar 2, 2005 18:31:23 GMT -5
I just remembered that Master Hand and Crazy Hand are in Kirby and the Amazing Mirror (recently released on GBA). I don't have any screenshots, but I could probably find them. This means, though, that Master and Crazy Hand do exist, and that they do interact with the characters. Something to consider.
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Post by Kamikaze Koopa on Mar 2, 2005 23:37:36 GMT -5
Ah yes, I remember them now. Hmmm, does that mean that the Smash Bros games happen in Dreamland? After all, that is the place where most of the cameos happen. Samus and Metroids in one of the Kirby games (I forget which one), various Mario enemies in Links Awakening, ect. Perhaps Dreamland is the one place where all Nintendo universes collide.
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Post by TakuTheSamurai on Mar 3, 2005 13:30:19 GMT -5
Interesting... Dreamland=subcon? OMG oculd it be true? I wouldn't be surprised if the SSB games DID occur in dreamland. After all, HAL makes both Kirby and SSB.
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Post by Claws on Mar 3, 2005 18:23:23 GMT -5
Well, I'm pretty convinced that Popstar and Mushroom Earth are in the same dimension, so this makes sense. But I still would like to believe that the theft of the star rod (in one of the Kirby games; I can't remember which) caused dreams to go haywire, which subsequently caused Mario's dreams of this strange land to materialize. I got this theory from a guy on another forum.
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Post by TakuTheSamurai on Mar 4, 2005 0:29:59 GMT -5
I remember taht game.... just not the title.
An interesting, and highly plausible theory. While i'm certainly no expert on Kirbyverse technology or anything (having only played Kirby 64: crystal shards), I would not be surprised if the "star rod" incident coincided with the events of SMB2. Perhaps the Kirby badguy left Wart as a lieutanant of sorts that kirby never dealt with, but Mario and accomplices did?
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Post by Yoshi Master on Mar 19, 2005 11:34:30 GMT -5
The Smash Bros. games never happened.
SMB2 did...
Subcons ( rulers of Subcon ) travel in and out of Subcon and the Mushroom World with those cute pink doors. The subcons always destroy the doors when their done with it. Somtimes if a doorway isn't destroyed creatures get through.
Through a celestial event a doorway to Yoshi's Island was made and not destroyed. Shyguys came though and populated. The Yoshi's ate or killed the shyguys ( because they worked with Bowser and Kamek )and thats why their not there in SMW.
Bowser always liked Shyguys for their crafty ways and sneakyness. Bowser made the Toy Box for the Shyguys to protect the Star Spirit, and nothing more. The Toy Box was later abandoned and destroyed with it's purpose failed.
Here's how SMB2 is real:
When the Mario gang beat Wart they where waving at the Subcon's. Behind them a group of Subcon's put them to sleep and opened a doorway to the Mushroom World. The Subcons carried the Mario gang to their beds and made it look like a dream. The Subcon's knew that humans would only civilise Subcon. The old ways of castles and magic sweet and the Subcon's didn't want them all up in their hizzey.
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Post by Kamikaze Koopa on Mar 19, 2005 11:39:35 GMT -5
Sounds plausible.
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Post by Yoshi Master on Mar 19, 2005 12:48:37 GMT -5
I made a sprite comic of it but I don't know how to put it in here like your pics. Help?
And my member pic isn't showing whys that?
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